Is the ovulius the same as the oujia board?

[Pam]

Is the ovilus the same as the oujia board? And is wrong for a Christian to own and use one?

What is an ovilus? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyRzX35kVn4

The Old Testament priest used Urim and Thummim to hear from God. WVould it be wrong to anoint an Ovulius to be an Urim and Thummim to hear from God. I know that God uses the Holy Spirit to speak to His children but the ovilus would be an easier device to hear from God.

The Urim and Thumim would be consulted like an oracle; the High Priest would meditate on the stones until he reached a level of divine inspiration. He would see the breastplate with inspired vision, and the letters containing the answer would appear to light up or stand out. With his divine inspiration, the High Priest would then be able to combine the letters to spell out the answer (Yoma 73b; Ramban; Bachya on Numbers 28:21; cf. Handbook of Jewish Thought 6:36).

Some say that the word Thumim has the connotation of pairing, since it was the inspiration that allowed the priest to arrange the letters to spell out a message (Bachya on Numbers 28:21). Others say that the message was called Thumim (perfect) because it was irrevocable (Midrash HaGadol; cf. Yoma 73b).

[Anneli]

Hello Pam,

What I feel about this is that we never know who we get in touch with through means such as pendulums or ouija boards (unless we develop in love to the point where we can feel who we are talking to / communicating with), except that it is not God.

God only communicates with us through emotions, not words.

If we hear or get words from someone, it is safe to assume that it is a spirit person communicating with us. Spirit persons can be very loving or very unloving, have only loving intentions with what they tell us, or not. It's just people like ourselves, and they are sometimes pretending to be something or someone that they are not, only to achieve something for themselves through their interactions with us here on Earth. In other words, if you believe you are communicating with God when using a pen and paper, a pendulum or similar items, then I'd say you are being mislead to believe something that is not true.

God is constantly offering us His and Her love, but we are too often distracted by our own desire to avoid the sadness, anger, hate, fears and shame and what have you, inside ourselves to notice. And, we can't really receive God's love without facing and feeling through all of those emotions in the process, making room for even more of God's love in our soul as we progress.

I'm fully open to be corrected if I've understood something about this wrong, but this is how I currently feel about this.

[Alkhemst]

If our earliest sense of the what's around us before all our other senses develop is just feeling, and if God really loves us, I'd imagine he'd want to communicate with us straight away via those feelings. So without any complexity or tools, just God's soul to our soul.

If that's true, and makes sense to me at least, I'd ask myself why I'm trying to make it more complicated. Potentially there's a direct connection from God to me, and if I can accept that God loves me, and I know I have the capacity to feel things, I'd have to wonder why I'm looking for other ways that are more difficult to connect with God.

I suppose it means that I feel God wants to make it difficult for me, and so maybe I find it hard to accept that God loves me as I am without any fanfare and wants to connect with me in such a simple way that even a child can do it.

I hope that's helpful.

[Tara]

I would not look at this subject as right or wrong. When looking at the emotions which drive anyone to use a tool of some kind as the ones you have described here, wanting to use an ovulius may bring up some emotions if there are some there to feel. Now if you are using the device in a loving way with no addictions in play then it would be better, although if you were in a loving space I cannot see the device being necessary since you would be able to connect with spirits without the use of a device.

[Pam]

What I feel about this is that we never know who we get in touch with through means such as pendulums or ouija boards (unless we develop in love to the point where we can feel who we are talking to / communicating with), except that it is not God.

I agree with you on this that is why I haven't used these devices and must of my Christian friends would also agree with you on this.

God only communicates with us through emotions, not words.

I have to disagree with you on this. God used words to create the universe and earth and everything in it. If you read the book of Genesis, He used words to create light, and everything created in those seven days.

He also spoke to the people though out the Bible with words. I believe He does use words to speak to His children and you can know it is Him by the love that is in those words. I have a prophetic gift and I have prophetic friends and we read each other messages and even though the message is spoken though many people, it is always the same type of style that the message is giving which means it is the same Spirit speaking though the people.

Some of the words that Father may say to me are:

My precious daughter, I love you and My love is never ending. There is nothing you could ever do to earn My love and there is nothing bad you could ever do to loose My love. I love you because I am love and it is in My natural to love you because I am God. For Me to stop loving you would mean I would have to stop being God. And I will never stop being God. I am a solid rock that you can stand on and trust in. You never have to ever worry about loosing My love. Nothing can separate you from My love. There is nothing in the universe that can ever come between you and me. Even hell can not separate you from My love when you cry out to Me to forgive you, to fill you with My love then you can come out of hell and be united with Me in My kingdom. As you progress more in My love you then become one with Me.

[Brian Brill]

God only communicates with us through emotions, not words.

I have to disagree with you on this. God used words to create the universe and earth and everything in it. If you read the book of Genesis, He used words to create light, and everything created in those seven days.

The fact that God communicates with us through emotions, not words, is a common part of AJ's teachings. That might be confronting to you if you have a lot invested in your hearing God's words.

May I ask just how much of AJ's material you have actually studied and for how long? Do you know this teaching but reject it?

Please don't misunderstand that I mean these words you receive are not inspired by God, they may well be. It's just that behind these words, however they get translated into your language, would be God's actual emotions. When connecting with us, it is loving that God requires that we conform to feel his precise, vast emotions rather than God conforming to us and our limited, imperfect languages. There is too much danger of us locking God into inexact symbolic representations. Obviously, we do quite enough of that already without God's help in the matter.

Also, Genesis is not a literal explanation of the creation. Here's AJ talking about that:
https://youtu.be/1AKrmFN6kfk?t=14m43s

Words are not a fundamental element of our existence the way that emotions are. And this makes sense, because everybody has Love, but some people have love, some people have laska, some people have liebe and some people have amore. All of these different symbolic patterns work to communicate the same thing because words are just a language, an agreed upon symbolic representation. They do not have an inherent reality unto themselves. And God did not need to symbolize anything in order to cause creation (other than the whole of creation being a symbol of God's Love), so words as we understand them were not necessary. Then when humans tried to put a creation account into words, they didn't have a full enough language to properly represent that activity. The word "Word" in this case could be a symbol for "a sound with intention". The universe is frequently observed to be an energetically vibrating reality, like a sound. In some ways it can be understood as being a song.

He also spoke to the people though out the Bible with words. I believe He does use words to speak to His children and you can know it is Him by the love that is in those words. I have a prophetic gift and I have prophetic friends and we read each other messages and even though the message is spoken though many people, it is always the same type of style that the message is giving which means it is the same Spirit speaking though the people.

Some of the words that Father may say to me are:

My precious daughter, I love you and My love is never ending. There is nothing you could ever do to earn My love and there is nothing bad you could ever do to loose My love. I love you because I am love and it is in My natural to love you because I am God. For Me to stop loving you would mean I would have to stop being God. And I will never stop being God. I am a solid rock that you can stand on and trust in. You never have to ever worry about loosing My love. Nothing can separate you from My love. There is nothing in the universe that can ever come between you and me. Even hell can not separate you from My love when you cry out to Me to forgive you, to fill you with My love then you can come out of hell and be united with Me in My kingdom. As you progress more in My love you then become one with Me.

This does sound like a spirit trying to communicate his understanding of God's feelings to you. This is common for spirit friends of the same general faith group to do. They want to help you, and communicate God's Love to the best of their ability to say, and your ability to hear. You might ask this spirit if it can help you achieve that connection to God's emotions directly. Even if we grant that this is God talking, do you not see that words are removed from the reality, and that it would be a better way to communicate via resonating with God's emotions instead, and that the real God would desire and assist with that? Can you see that "progress more in My Love" surely means to actually feel that Love more than it means to hear words representing that Love?

- B

[Pam]

May I ask just how much of AJ's material you have actually studied and for how long? Do you know this teaching but reject it?

I am a beginner. And yes I have listen to quite a few of his teachings. With all my teachers I study for myself to know if what they are saying is truth or not. I eat the meat and spite out the bones.


I have a lot of teachers that I love and I may agree with a lot of what they say and I may disagree on some things they may say.

For example i love Kenneth Copeland. I think he does a beautiful job at teaching people how to walk by faith. But I disagree with him that grieving is a sin. I believe there is healthy grief and unhealthy grief. Not all grief is evil.

I love Pastor Yeager. I enjoy his miracle stories and if you need healing he is the man to go too for healing but do I agree with everything he says no. Do I agree with a lot of things that he preaches yes. And I enjoy going to his church. He is the reason why I go to his church because he is so on fire for God.

I love Lisa Hicks she has a wonderful evangelist gift and I enjoy her preaching but do I believe she has the gift to prophecy or to know everything about people no I don't? That is because she seems to read me wrong each time she prophecies over me. When she says that God told her my favorite color is yellow then I know she didn't here from God. When she looks at an out dated family picture and tells me to be more strict with my oldest daughter then I know she didn't get a message from God because my daughter is married with kids. She isn't a kid anymore. And if God truly spoke to her God would have told her my picture was an out dated family picture. I don't trust her prophetic words because she has given me wrong information so I judge a prophecy by its accuracy. When I email her and told her she didn't hear from God she block me. So her lack of accuracy and lack of love tells me she isn't a prophetess.

So far I haven't seen anything that Joyce Meyers has preached that I disagree with. I love this woman. Her sermons always seem to speak to me. And I probably should make a habit of turning her on everyday. She really does speak to me about my life.

I love AJ and a lot of his teachings have answered my questions but do I ever disagree with him yes on some things but I do agree with him on the majority of things.I I agree with him about praying for more love and walking in more love. But I am having a hard time agreeing with him that God doesn't speak to us though words because this is the kind of relationship that I do have with God and I have been in the prophetic community for years and read hundreds of prophetic words from different prophets. I know the voice of My Father. Do I ever run into a false prophets yes lots of times and I have had real prophets prophecy over me. I know they hear from God by their accuracy and love.

I had a life changing prophetic word that sat me free when I thought I committed the unpardonable sin and I didn't tell a soul about what I was going though and a prophetess named Ruth gave me a very accurate word from God on that He loved me and forgave me. And I not only got a life changing word but healed from some painful stomach cramps. I felt so much love from God that day and I am so glad He spoke to me though Ruth. It would have been horrible to live the rest of my life thinking that I committed the unpardonable sin. I went though a whole week believing I committed the unpardonable sin and it was hell believing this. I am so glad God loved me enough to let me know that I did not committed the unpardonable sin.


I am just being honest with you at where i am at in all this and I hope this is ok to be open and honest at where I am. Maybe I should explain that I am Charismatic/Pentecostal. Do I 100% agree with the Pentecostals no. Because I still love wearing my make up and jewel and I still love rock and roll. But do I raise my hands in church and dance and sing yes. And operate in the gifts of the spirit yes. And I find that God loves me no matter what. But I also have learned to be more open minded to things. My Charismatic friends would not like that I am open to the fact there could be life on other planets, that reincarnation could be possible, and that ghosts are just people that have died that need to cross over into the light. For them ghosts, aliens, and reincarnation are all demonic. So yes I can agree on a lot of things and disagree on a lot of things regardless of the Christian religion that I am hanging out with.

I wanted to say that I don't believe any style of music is demonic but I do believe that the words is what makes the music good or evil. It isn't the beat that makes a piece of music evil. I sure hope that the music in heaven has a nice beat to it. I don't like hard rock or rap but that is just my taste. I am sure there is Christian rape, and I know there is Christian hard rock but I just don't like that kind of music. Maybe God likes all styles of music that praise Him. I kind of think He likes classic and orchestra type music.

[Brian Brill]

I am just being honest with you at where i am at in all this and I hope this is ok to be open and honest at where I am.

Well of course I personally think that's very OK. From all you've said you will likely find some points of contention between what AJ teaches and what others here will likely also espouse. Your apparently more fundamentalist religious/Christian background will be challenged at points, but your openness to new information and sometimes just new interpretations of old information is really the key thing, I think. We all are where we are, and I hope we at least all generally agree about where we would like to go, even if we have different understandings of how we get there.

- B

[Pam]

Do you think a person can keep their traditional Christian beliefs and still pray and receive God's divine love? I am not as traditionally as must Christians but I am not ready to throw out all my Christian beliefs yet. I am not where I used to be with my traditional beliefs and i am sure I won't be where I am now with my traditional beliefs ten years from now.

[Brian Brill]

Do you think a person can keep their traditional Christian beliefs and still pray and receive God's divine love?

Generally you can certainly pray and get Divine Love regardless of belief, as long as your soul is emotionally open for it. But some beliefs can be blocks. For example, if your belief is that God is a punishing god, or that you are wretched and unworthy, the stronger that such beliefs are, the more likely it will shut down the flow of God's Love, because Truth is a prerequisite for that Love to flow.

I am not as traditionally as must Christians but I am not ready to throw out all my Christian beliefs yet. I am not where I used to be with my traditional beliefs and i am sure I won't be where I am now with my traditional beliefs ten years from now.

The way I see it, what AJ is teaching are the *actual* Christian beliefs. I grew up surrounded by a traditional Christian environment, so I know how that can be. But early on I had to go through a process of figuring out what things Jesus was trying to teach, and what things priests had inserted into the doctrines. Obviously you have already at least begun that process for yourself rather than accepting every dogma that comes from the pulpit. Good for you on that.

What I did was evaluate each belief using this criteria: Is this something that would be taught by a loving God, or does it seem more like a human interpretation of what God might want, or does it even serve the interests of humans in spite of God? For example, would God teach that the best animals must be killed in sacrifice and the meat given to the priests, or would priests want everyone to believe that so that they could get free meat? I know that's a pre-Christian thing, but how about whether or not Jesus was a sacrifice for our sins? Would a loving God require sacrifice at all, or is that more likely an old human idea that was applied to Jesus after the fact to rationalize why the Messiah could even be killed?

This is the same "is it loving" test that AJ recommends when considering what is taught by the Bible and the churches. But from what I have seen, he isn't interested in tearing down any particular Church so much as just correcting the misunderstandings they have. Even if all the churches embraced Divine Truth teachings, there would likely still be plenty different styles of worship. Some people like lots of ritual and structure and others are not really interested in any organized church at all. People are different, and Divine Truth isn't about making everyone the same, except in that they are more loving.

- B